One issue I have (and my other friends who are trying out GTD), is how to manage amorphous projects. The first example, is reading a book. Not a someday reading list item, but lets say a book I've borrowed from someone and would like to get back. As an action, "Read book" seems wrong, since I can't really check that off. I suppose I could add chapters, but it still feels odd. A better example is software development. The end goal is often known (but not necessarily always for investigations), but it is often impossible to know what the actions would be until actually working on the project. So again, the action of "Work on code" doesn't seem like enough, but even small actions might be difficult to complete, and preplanning would be folly (as David discussed in this podcast). Hopefully this makes sense, though I wouldn't be surprised if there was a simple answer that I'm missing.

I listened to the pod cast and was wondering what you and David use to track your project lists. I have been using the GTD Outlook Addin and then I tried using Mind Manager. This created a burst of energy but somehow it did not seem like the answer. Something was still missing. I guess neither of these really gave me the control and perspective I was hoping for. Your thoughts would be appreciated.

Hi Steve - I keep my master Project list in Palm Desktop within Tasks. I like that program for my list management. It's got a nice, clean, simple interface.

My project plans are in many different places, depending on the project. For example:
1.Emails in project folders

2. Lotus Notes databases

3. Mind Manager mindmaps

4. hard copy stuff in manilla file folders

5. the notes field of the project on the master Project list

6. documents and spreadsheets

7. checklists in my Memo pad if it's a recurring project
...to name a few.

I know it would be simpler if all of my project plans were in one place, and organized exactly the same way, but I've never found that possible.

My Project list has 35 projects on there right now. I review the list about once a week in my Weekly Review to make sure each project has a next action captured on the Action lists or calendar. Sometimes I need to go back to wherever the project plans are kept to figure out that next action, other times it's obvious what comes next and it wasn't part of any plan. The Weekly Review seems to be the best way for me to get perspective and control on projects. Sometimes, just reviewing that Projects list relieves the stress more than anything else.

Kelly

Hi Scott,

I posed your question to David Allen and here's his reply:
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"Read book" is a fine next action. You can check that off. Next actions don't have to be short - they just have to be the very next thing to do, that requires no more thinking to know what to do and where it happens.

"Develop code" is a fine next action. As long as you know that's the next thing, you don't need anything else, and you know where it happens. My common version of that is "draft ideas re:________" - I can mark that off as done when I've core-dumped about the project/theme/topic enough to have it off my mind.

DA
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Hope this helps!

Kelly

I am a member of bookcrossing (a book sharing network) and I keep track of books I have borrowed and have to return, or books I have promised to someone else but have to read first. So I have a bookcrossing (super-)project, which has subprojects for each read and send. The next action is often "Read x book". I even have a read/review context to keep track of these sort of items. It works well for me.

My unrelated question is about managing dependencies in multiple projects. I have lots of subprojects within projects, as it is the only way to get some of my projects out of my head. However, this sometimes means that I have multiple next-action tasks within one big project, and multiple links of dependencies between subprojects. I have taken to trying not to plan too far in advance. This sometimes doesn't work as I start to worry about what I will need to do in the future on x project, and I end up having to set all that out in order to get it out of my head. I am using iGTD to manage my projects and notes software to manage my someday/maybes etc, and I am reluctant to move to other project management software, as I don't want to switch between programs much.

Thanks for the podcast, that was interesting.

Being a software developer, as mentioned on a question here, "develop code" is actually a poor next action, it is like a builder saying "finish bathroom".

You don't have to list every single step for your coding project, but at least your next few _immediate_ steps for your coding project. There may often be a small number of discrete next actions you can work on, and once they have finished, it is usually pretty obvious what needs to be worked on next.

Sometimes I find it useful to still dump out a rough list of tasks I need to complete for a coding project just to get it out of my head.

Cheers,
David