New Book - Using Outlook but with GTD stuff all thru it

[Walter]

Picked up a new book from Microsoft Press yesterday called "Take Back Your Life" by Sally McGhee. It is a productivity guide to using Outlook to clean up your life.

I was surprised to open it and find David Allen's GTD flowchart in it (with some minor modifications). Topics in the book include things like "collecting", the 4-Ds (Dump, Do, Delegate, Defer), Next Actions, etc.

I was starting to think she'd plagarized a bunch of David's stuff, but then I saw that she mentions David in the acknowledgments.

Anyway thought you'd all be interested. I was just published with a copyright date of 2005. Here is the Amazon link:

http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0735620407/qid=1096383656/sr=1-20/ref=sr_1_20/103-2387533-4630223?v=glance&s=books

[Longstreet]

Yep -- I got it as well. It is an excellent book! And, it is REMARKABLY similar to the GTD approach. :shock:

Longstreet

[Julian]

How did you read it if Amazon says that it isn't available yet?

Julian

[Longstreet]

Hi Julian,

It turns out that I received a copy from Amazon that has defective binding. :cry: When I notified them, they said their entire shipment was like this :shock: and that I could obtain a replacement once the new shipment is in. I still have the volume, though, and finished reading it last night. It really is quite good, with the entire focus on setting up Outlook as an Integrated Management System.

Longstreet

[ext555]

do a web search -- Barnes and Noble has it and so does Quantam books.

Looks like Amazon is just picking it up.

[Anonymous]

Does the book have much applicability to Entourage users?

[Walter]

How did you read it if Amazon says that it isn't available yet?


I bought it at Borders, but as was posted, B&N has it.

[Julian]

Hi Julian,

It turns out that I received a copy from Amazon that has defective binding.
Longstreet

Thanks much for the info.
Julian

[bdavidson]

I stopped by the local Borders on the way home from work to check this book out. I could only spent about 4 minutes perusing it, but on the surface, it seemed to be an expanded version of David's GTD whitepaper on Outlook. Having paid $30 for the Outlook PDF a couple years ago, is the info in this book compelling enough to spend another $15-20 for similar information?

I notices the author uses SNA's (Strategic Next Actions), and "1:1 Fred" vs. "@Agendas", but still seems to organize tasks by categories.

For those that have read it, a comparative analysis would be helpful to see if it builds on GTD principles or detracts from them.

I'd also like to know as a curiosity if the David Allen Company gets any royalties from the book since it is so heavily based on the GTD workflow process (in other words, I'd hate to support a pirate!). That pessimism aside, I think it's a significant surge into the mainstream for GTD principles when Microsoft Press is publishing a book for the average overworked Outlook user who hasn't been enlightened enough to discover David Allen on their own.

There is also a Microsoft Webcast scheduled for Oct 19 with the author titled "Email Tips to Set the Rules for Productivity". I imagine it will pull heavily from the new book. Link below:

http://msevents.microsoft.com/CUI/WebCastEventDetails.aspx?EventID=1032259508&Cultur e=en-US

Brian

[stargazer_rick]

I read this article this morning on TheKnow.net site (Microsoft Business Solutions). It's titled, "Personal Productivity: Need a Makeover?" and seems to be loaded with GTD techniques:
http://www.theknow.net/Content/Page.aspx?c=527&v=1&z=10&r=&a=&p=&i=&o=&f=

Apparently these techniques are becoming the accepted norm for how to be productive in the modern day world of knowledge work. It seems that a lot of othe coaches and organizational gurus are teaching the same things.

[TesTeq]

CosmoGTD,
1) Your usage of GTC is a copyright infringement :lol: . It is my "Getting Things Complicated" unproductivity methodolgy trademark.
2) I do not know if the "CosmoGTD" name does not infrige the David Allen Company's GTD copyright as a derivative work :lol: .
But seriously we are waiting for David Allen Company statement.
TesTeq

[remyc88]

I thought copyrights don't apply to ideas? According to the US Gov, Copyright does not protect ideas, concepts, systems, or methods of doing something.

So stuff like "Next Actions," "Waiting For..." and the general GTD principles are not protected by copyrights.

[Longstreet]

Hi CosmoGTD,

I agree with your comments. I liked the book, but since I am an avid GTD person, no wonder I liked it! You noticed I said it was REMARKABLY similar. Perhaps I should have said UNCOMFORTABLY similar. :(

Longstreet

[ext555]

I thought M$oft was a client of DA's ?

There must have been some sort of agreeement or loophole somewhere?
I'm sure they would know better than to publish someone who just copied David's work .

[kglade]

maybe DA is writing under a pseudonym:)

Kinda like Steven King and other famous authors do.

[helenjc]

Coz and others,
Perhaps you should post your opinions on amazon - before people get ordering!

Very bizarre story - will be extremely interested to hear the word from davidco - someone please put us out of our misery as to what's going on here!!

cheers
Helen

[bdavidson]

There's got to be more to this story. I did also notice that in the Acknowledgements section of the book, she also thanked Leslie Boyer, one of the Davidco coaches.

Maybe Sally Mcghee had an individual coaching session from Davidco and decided to write a detailed book about it using Outlook. Or maybe she used to be employed by Davidco and was fired, or left to start her own company, claiming David ripped her off! :wink:

GTD itself doesn't care about Outlook, so maybe there was enough of a difference to publish as long as she focused on Outlook. Anyway, I ordered it for $12.50 through Overstock.com just to see if there are any better tips for GTD Outlook implementation.

Once the book is orderable on Amazon, we should be able to post reviews and even suggest GTD as one of those "instead of" suggestions Amazon lists.

Brian

[ext555]

oh wow Overstock.com - I didn't even think of them .

Curiousity got the best of me and I ordered it at local borders yesterday -- Oh well maybe they won't have it in within 7 days and I'll get it free :wink:
Either way if it's not legit I'll do my part to suggest GTD instead on all the book sites

I've alerted Davidco in the past about their workflow diagram showing up in some small biz mag (I can't remember which one )

I bet a lot of these people think a small co. like davidco won't be able to track every use of their materials like the big boys do ! But they're also un-aware of David's army of loyal followers just waiting to pounce :twisted:

[Anonymous]

Sally and I parted ways amicably in 1996, as she went to Colorado and I took the business at the time (Productivity Development Group), putting my name on the masthead and my own spin on the material which I had been the primary developer of, but which Sally contributed to a lot in its application and coaching. We agreed that she could use any of the stuff we developed in our years together, which obviously includes much of the GTD material. Microsoft was her primary client, and she focused a lot of her consulting work with them in the intervening years - hence her connections there. We wish her the best with all that she's doing.

David

[Anonymous]

By the way, many thanks to all of you who are watching our backside! We're totally tickled and appreciative that you folks care.

David

[Walter]

I did get an email reply late yesterday. Very professional - you have a great team David.


Walter,

Thank you so for "outing" yourself, but no need to worry. Sally used to work for David and we're aware of the book and the similarities. But I must say the message board posts have been delightful to read, I had no idea what a loyal following David has....and we are so appreciative!

Kind regards,

Anne

___________________
Anne Gennett
The David Allen Company

[bdavidson]

Coz and others,
Perhaps you should post your opinions on amazon - before people get ordering!

Very bizarre story - will be extremely interested to hear the word from davidco - someone please put us out of our misery as to what's going on here!!

cheers
Helen

Amazon now seems to be shipping the book, and therefore, we are able to post reviews and "additional recommendations" (like GTD instead of or in addition to Take Back Your Life)...

I would personally like to see people read GTD first then Take Back Your Life for Outlook-specific recommendations for implementation, if they use Outlook.

Brian

[ceehjay]

Amazon now seems to be shipping the book, and therefore, we are able to post reviews and "additional recommendations" (like GTD instead of or in addition to Take Back Your Life)...

I would personally like to see people read GTD first then Take Back Your Life for Outlook-specific recommendations for implementation, if they use Outlook.

Brian

Amazon lists Take Back Your Life! (http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0735620407/qid=1097326633/sr=1-1/ref=sr_1_1/103-1935168-7755000?v=glance&s=books) as not yet released, but they will take pre-orders. No reviews yet. So, Brian, are you going to post your recommendation? I haven't read TBYL, and I'm not certain that I will.

Carolyn

[Anonymous]

I would leave a review if it allowed one, couldn't find the button or space to do it on the page. You can check out Davids response to the book, I guess they worked together at one time and went their seperate ways with no hard feekings.

I enjoyed this book alot, It helped me get me Outlook up and running GTD (ok so she calls things by other names) but it well worth a read if you are useing Outlook. I picked up at Powels here in Portland for 13.00.

I read it and here style was alot like reading the RSS feed that this comes in.
I picked it up because I was curious,and I'm glad I did.

[Bert]

Noting the similarities of the two books, I figured that there had to be a business relationship somewhere in the mix. David's GTD is the core of my system, but I "enhance" it using several support systems (such as how better to track support material for projects). I'm curious to know if there is a link between David and William Oncken, Jr., who wrote an article in the Harvard Business Review entitled, "Managing Management Time: Who's Got The Monkey?" (Nov, 1974), that likened tasks to monkeys that needed to be managed. This is was further described in "The One Minute Manager Meets the Monkey", written by Oncken and Kenneth Blanchard (Copyright, 1989), in which a monkey was defined as the "next physical action" needed to move a task or project forward. Just wondering...

[Anonymous]

I bought this book recently and while it would be useful for anyone who hadn't read GTD, for the rest it doesn't really add much. In fact if anything it can be irritating with Sally's substitution of easy phrases such as Next Actions with Strategic Next Actions. Has that really simplified anything? There's plenty more with catch phrases like Integrated Management System, and Meaningful Objectives replacing terms which work and that have become ingrained to GTD'ers. Coumter-productive in my view.

I went ahead and purchased as I am an Outlook user and always keen to pick up any tips and I read that like me, Sally uses her Calendar slightly differently to the David Allen method and this was the crux and major selling point of her new book. Unfortunately this section was very brief and I learned nothing I didn't already know.

For me GTD was the most practical book on organising I've ever read with thankfully little fluff and plenty of clear and concise methodology. I paid the full original price for David Allen's Workflow Processing using the Microsoft Outlook paper and hand on heart, even now that it's available for $10 I still can't say I regret buying it. As a companion to his book there isn't much more an Outlook user could need.

In contrast I find his latest book Ready for Anything quite whimsical and like Sally's book it doesn't really add much to the core provided by GTD and Workflow Processing.

[Anonymous]

This is was further described in "The One Minute Manager Meets the Monkey", written by Oncken and Kenneth Blanchard (Copyright, 1989), in which a monkey was defined as the "next physical action" needed to move a task or project forward. Just wondering...

I found Getting Things Done to be one of the most useful books I've ever read, but one could hardly expect that each idea in it was invented by David Allen. Another example, like the one in the above quote, is seen in "repositories" for joint software or writing projects; the concept known as the token (who is responsible for the next action on a certain file) has been around many years before GTD was published. Similarly, the concept of a next action is central to the design of the Life Balance software, written long before GTD was.

In fact, the more fundamentally true and helpful an idea is, the more likely I would expect that many intelligent people would independently think of it.

A core idea of GTD that I had never heard before was that I needed to have everything in one system and not in my head. DA said that I needed to process every piece of paper, every bit of "stuff." I had considered that process impossible, but here DA said, Well, it might take a few days but it will be worth it. And for me, it has been worth it. I'm indebted to GTD for motivating me to process everything.

-andersons

[Anonymous]

Yow, if there ever were proof of the virtues of GTD and acquiring the kind of focus Mr. Allen helps foster, its in his own response on this thread. I myself started churning with resentment over the perceived opportunism of the McGhee book, but Mr. Allen himself sails on by the entire issue. What a terrific example; I aspire to deploy my energy as wisely.

Mr. Allen's methods may use a word here and term there that have been used elsewhere in a similar context, but my sense is that the evolution of his process is organic and visible, and it feels undeniably and authentically his. When you're looking for someone to help you save you from drowning in detrius, you want the real thing.

Sally can keep her book. I use Ecco, anyway. :lol:

[pjd]

Hello everyone. This is my first post,
and on an exciting thread too :D

I have compared David Allen's GTD and
Sally McGhee TBYL workflow diagrams.
Overall, I prefer the GTD approach because the system and tool are
independent. This orthogonality (software engineering-speak)
is a beneficial design principle. While this may mean I have to spend
an extra $10 (ok, I won't eat lunch out one day) to buy the
implementation pdf, it is much easier to grasp the concepts in GTD
before attempting to install.

Since GTD was published before TBYL, TBYL has the advantage
of hindsight and added what I understand are 3 differences in the
workflow process.

TBYL
1. asks an additional question: Is this action belong to a meaningful objective? and
dismisses anything
2. puts actions onto the calendar.
3. distinguishes 2 types of significant actions.

I would like to ask 2 questions.
1) Are these the only differences in the workflow?
2) Are they worth doing (particularly the first question, which appears
to be a link between the Covey approach of mission statement/roles&goals
with GTD)?

Thanks :P

[bassdrone42]

I picked up this book a few months ago and haven't found much use for it.

Buying the $10.00 download for outlook will, with the GTD book you already have, will give the same benefit in my opinion.

Other than a few terminology differences I couldn't see the difference between GTD and TBYL.

Notice how many times David Allen is mentioned? ......Once, and only a tiny quote in the margin!

[bdavidson]

I think it's also worth noting that in the acknowledgements for Gettings Things Done, David mentions Sally McGhee.

[bassdrone42]

PJD

If an action is not meaningful why would you do it?

[pjd]

PJD

If an action is not meaningful why would you do it?

Exactly. I'm wondering if there really is any benefit to these additions
that TBYL described. I would rather re-read GTD a third time and try to customize the add-in (as others have excellently detailed on this thread), than to spend time learning the TBYL approach.
-pjd