Best Time Management

[westwind]

Although I've listened to "Getting Things Done" and "Ready for Anything" several times on tape, I still find the Covey books "Seven Habits" and "First Things First" to be the core of my life and time management philosophy. I find myself wishing that David Allen and Stephen Covey were working for the same company. I find Allen's "Ready for Anything" to be a great book of insights on how to better implement Covey's "First Things First." Many of Allen's insights are things that Covey himself is not that good at expressing, for example the Psychic RAM concept.

I have also learned a lot from Allen's book GTD. But where I part ways with Allen is in Chapter 9 when it comes time to make the decision on what to actually do at any moment. After 8 chapters of meticulous preparation in task organizing, I can't believe that Allen then just says "trust your heart" to make the decision. To me, this is exactly why I and others tend to manage time badly. I think that Covey's "perspective of the week" is where it's really at. If I were to just "trust my heart", I would spend all my time doing trivial things, and the truly important tasks would rarely get done.

The other book I've found helpful is Rita Emmett's "Procrastinator's Handbook."

[serotta]

But if you truly have everything down in the right context then you should be able to trust yourself to do the right thing. In Covey terms I see that as "integrity in the moment of choice". Trust your lists, and do what's on your list. If it really needs to be on your "hard landscape" than put it there.

[spectecGTD]

I understand the problem you express, but I believe you are oversimplyfying the process by which the tasks get onto the lists (the first 8 chapters). You can really "trust your heart" when you have done all the thinking at the front end. Before an item even gets onto a list you have already

1) Defined a successful outcome;
2) Decided the very next thing (N/A) that needs to be done to move you toward that outcome;
3) Placed that N/A on its appropriate context list; and
4) Included the overall project in a leak-proof comprehensive regular review (weekly or more).

Incidentally, the weekly review is where your "heart" is being tuned in order for you to be able to trust it.

[jkgrossi]

But if you truly have everything down in the right context then you should be able to trust yourself to do the right thing. In Covey terms I see that as "integrity in the moment of choice". Trust your lists, and do what's on your list. If it really needs to be on your "hard landscape" than put it there.

That's how I see it as well. I think that Covey's methods work great, if you work in a vaccum. I can't tell you how many times I sat down on Sunday and "planned my week", down to the ABC's & 123's, only to come into work on Monday and find that none of it was relevant anymore - My boss's priorities had shifted, fires had to be put out, etc. My weekly plan was toast in a matter of 10 minutes...

And I also found that when I WAS able to work according to my pre-planned priorities, "C" stuff never got done - which was a problem. They weren't necessarily "important" or "urgent", but needed to be done none the less.

Personally, I am MUCH more productive with GTD than I ever was with Covey. Just my $.02.

[Danny Hardesty]

I have "read them all"...from Lakein's classic all the way through to current best-sellers. After reading all of the classic time management books my desk was still a mess, piles were everywhere, and it was disheartening to look at an ever-growing dog-eared "to-do" list which cluttered up an already junked up desk.

Then David's book Getting Things Done came along. Miracles do happen...the desk is now clean...file cabinets are orderly....the in-box is empty and collecting dust....the "to-do" list is a thing of the past, and my powerful engine "the tickler file" is hidden away in a drawer inside my executive desk and roaring to go.

To make a long story short, David's "system" is simply the best.

Danny Hardesty

www.dannyhardesty.com

[Desultory]

Before an item even gets onto a list you have already [done a lot of planning.]

And then, this planning helps you winnow down your commitments to a list you really can do in the next week. So if you're fully committed to all your Next Actions, it shouldn't matter what order you do them in.

That's my theory, anyway.

[1drummergirl]

I have "read them all" as well and I have actually come to a very nicely balanced blend of both Covey and Allen. I won't go too much into the detail of my implementation, but I do sort out all my projects by role and then break the actions down into contexts. I use Covey's compassing to plan my hard landscape (but not every second of the day) each week and then I use GTD to fill in the gaps as I go through the week. So in simple terms, I use Covey for my calendar and Allen for my tasks/projects and I find they work beautifully together.

[alsa]

Wow, I just posted my query about exact same thing in another post here! Glad I saw this -- this is resolving some of the issues for me.

[alsa]

That's how I see it as well. I think that Covey's methods work great, if you work in a vaccum. I can't tell you how many times I sat down on Sunday and "planned my week", down to the ABC's & 123's, only to come into work on Monday and find that none of it was relevant anymore - My boss's priorities had shifted, fires had to be put out, etc. My weekly plan was toast in a matter of 10 minutes...

And I also found that when I WAS able to work according to my pre-planned priorities, "C" stuff never got done - which was a problem. They weren't necessarily "important" or "urgent", but needed to be done none the less.

Personally, I am MUCH more productive with GTD than I ever was with Covey. Just my $.02.

Hear, Hear!

[alsa]

And then, this planning helps you winnow down your commitments to a list you really can do in the next week. So if you're fully committed to all your Next Actions, it shouldn't matter what order you do them in.

That's my theory, anyway.


Wow! That's a great point!

[Gameboy70]

Covey's method is a better system for time management that Allen's because it is a system for time management. GTD is a different paradigm. It's a system for managing focus from moment to moment within a complete inventory of projects and actions.

Time management models are only effective to the extent that they minimize the number of activies they track. Hence the recurring advice to concentrate on the top three things, or to codify tasks by ABC, 1-2-3 or quadrant assignments. These systems lack the bandwidth to sustain a complete list of open loops. So prioritization is used to reduce one's conscious awareness of all the open loops that would overload the systems (try putting your 200 next actions on your calendar). But every open loop, little or big, is a piece of conscious awareness diverted.

By contrast, the GTD system tracks everything that holds sway on our attention, from writing the novel to feeding the cat. The real rigor of the system is in capturing everything as soon as it enters your head and processing it soon after. So there's no free lunch. But unless you intend to become a full-time productivity geek, you can't maintain the discipline of ubiquitous capture and micromanage it all in a priority matrix with no modifiers for time, energy and context.

Time management is best suited for defining work or doing predefined work. But these systems are too ossified to adapt to work that suddenly shows up, or for seizing windows of opportunity when appointments are delayed or cancelled.

To trust your intuition, you need to free your intuition by emptying your head, making decisions what to do about everything that came out of your head, and place those results where you'll see them when you can actually do something about them. Once this becomes a reliable habit, then trusting your heart to decide what to do next becomes an informed decision.

[Busydave]

I think that every other system fits inside GTD. Whatever your method for deciding what to do – be it “trust your heart”, Brain Tracy style prioritization, Covey role related etc –your decision will be made so much easier if you have all of your stuff nailed down in a fully up to date GTD system.

“Trust your heart” isn’t such a bad model: we all have a pretty good idea of what we really should be doing, and GTD gives you the energy and freedom to go for the right task when the context is right and when you know that EVERYTHING else is not forgotten but is listed for later execution.

GTD is a way for managing all of the stuff that is coming at you all of the time. You need the focused part of your brain, your psychic Ram, to be at its best to deal with all of this stuff… You do not want to use you psychic ram as a storage area.

We are already born with a set of needs that are looking for fulfilment: family, social, civic, spiritual, creative etc. Covey guides us towards making sure our week's plans are based around those areas so that we can feel more fulfilled as human beings. But he has not invented those roles; he is just reminding us that we will feel better if we fulfill those roles. (Tony Robbins is more direct about this in RPM – he reminds us that in life all we want to do is feel good, and we will feel good if we identify our roles in life and plan our week around them).

What David Allen recognizes is that our life is all about our project lists. What goes so your project lists? All the things that are rattling around in your head crying out to be done. And here is the link – all of those nagging open loops in your head are incongruities between how you want your life to be (in line with your basics human needs – family, creative, etc) and how your life actually is. It is very unlikely that any of these open loops come from anything else but your basic human needs.

Now, how do I decide what projects should go on my active project list? I only need to be reminded once that I should keep projects on the go that cover a range of human needs – father, husband, creative – after that, it’s as obvious as remembering to bring an umbrella on a rainy day.

[spectecGTD]

This BB contains many useful, informative threads and is a great resource for ideas about numerous aspects of GTD. However, without detracting from any of the other discussions, I would like to say that from the standpoint of doing an overview (i.e. backing off & looking at the whole game) this is one of the most interesting threads I've seen on this BB in a long time.

I hope others will continue to add their thoughts.

[Bob Burtt]

I am a basic guy...I like to keep things simple and explain them the same way. I am also a big Flanklin Covey fan. When I had GTD referred to me, I read it relunctantly until about the middle of the book. I even debated my friend about it a lot. He kindly said "Just keep reading". So, I shut up, and kept reading. Then it clicked. So, I now liken all this stuff as follows:

I liken the Franklin Covey stuff to having a Bachelors degree. It is a great base on what to build a great future education.

I liken GTD to a Doctorate, not only theory, but LOTS of practical. Now, I truly understand workflow. I don't even "A,B,C" anymore because I DO trust my instincts.

Franklin Covey is amazing stuff and I will never shoot it down. But GTD was and is my continued graduate program.

I hope that helps a little.

Bob

[BigStory]

Bob, I liked your analogy, but then I would have to say "Get your Doctorate first!" I too was someone who "read them all." What I found was that it didn't matter what my goals were, or my roles for that matter, it all boiled down to next actions in the end if I wanted to "Get it Done." In addition, if I didn't get a handle on what was on my plate now, I had liitle room to think about or implement the higher altitude stuff.

GTD changed everything for me. I was able to get my head into a space where I was peaceful enough to think clearly about my goals. Then, I was able to efficiently move forward on what I really wanted, as well as put the rest of life "in its place." Add to this the other benefits such as knowing your limits so you don't take on more than you are able etc.

I think you can "add" to GTD if you want coaching at higher altitudes, but you cannot substitute it with something else. As David says, it is not "a system" it is "the system" because it teaches what is most fundamental to getting *anything* done that you are truly committed to.

Best Wishes,
Gordon

[westwind]

Thank you everyone for all these great replies to my original post. This is really helpful to me, and I hope it also is to others. I wasn't aware there were people who fully understood Covey and yet felt that Allen was a better system. I think I will now give the GTD system a full-blown try, rather than just using it as helpful hints.

A few other thoughts:

One additional difference between Covey and Allen is that Covey is more of a philosophical life system, in addition to time management. For example, I find that having a personal mission statement can be very helpful for times when my self-esteem is a little down. And it also just helps keep me oriented in the right direction generally. Much of what Covey talks about in Seven Habits is like a guide to life and how to approach it.

The participants in this forum are probably weighted in favor of those who think Allen superior to Covey. If you read the low-rated Amazon.com reviews of GTD, you find opinions similar to my original post.

We shouldn’t discount the similarities between Covey and Allen. Both do have a concept of the perspective of the week.

I think that both Covey and Allen understand that individuals will eventually customize the systems. This can include the blending of Covey and Allen, as some have described here. However, one thing that should be done before customizing is to try the system exactly as is for a period of time (a week, a month, etc) to truly “learn it.” Then after that period, you can customize.

One additional book that rounds out my “Bible” of self-help books is Carnegie’s “How to Win Friends…” I know this book gets slammed a lot these days as being artificial. I would agree that “How to Win Friends” is a poor guide in one’s personal life. However, in the context of business, I think this book has a lot of useful hints on how to have effective interpersonal relationships.

[Sarah9847]

I am a GTD newbie (as in, I just finished the book and am still implementing the system), though I've been using covey pretty faithfully for about the last three years. I like the analogy that was made with bachelor's degree vs. Grad school. I recently switched careers, and have found that my franklin planner, which worked very well with a very regulated system of processes with each having a stable priority relative to the others was well nigh useless in my new, more managerial role where an email from my director can (and does!) turn my priorities on their head. I struggled along with my planner for a while, but was turned on to GTD by my brother, and I'm hooked.

However...I do think that there are some things Covey does better than Allen, perhaps because they aren't TRYING to do the exact same things. When it came to my 30,000 foot and up planning, I transferred my Covey Mission statement, roles, and goals almost without change. Whether or not you agree with his top down approach, Covey does provide a good framework for doing the strategic work that both Allen and Covey agree needs to be done at some point in the process. However, while appreciating the strategic strengths in the Covey paradigm, I like to know that I don't have to sort out the meaning of life in 50 words or less before I am allowed to process my inbox! (Yes, I'm exaggerating, but there's some truth there too...)

I guess what I'm saying is there's no "one true way" to this stuff, aside from the basic theoretical concepts that are common to any decent time/life management paradigm. GTD seems to offer a tradeoff between flexibility and rigor that I need in my new job that requires so much more creativity, leadership, and ability to deal with change. For most of us "knowledge workers", I think on the whole the benefits of GTD vs. Covey outweight the drawbacks, at least on a day-to-day level.

Sarah

[westwind]

Whether Covey or Allen, I find myself using a separate system for home (personal) and for work. Unlike some others, work/life balance is not a major issue for me. I don't like my work so much that I sacrifice a lot of personal time for it. So running two separate systems, one on my work computer and one on my home computer, seems to work best for me. I'm wondering if any others do the same thing.

[BigStory]

I guess what it boiled down to for me was that although Covey was quite helpful in clarifying purposes and planning to accomplish them, it didn't amount to nearly as much without GTD as with GTD. Covey provided a map, but David Allen provided a car, some gas and a couple of credit cards. :-)

Gordon

[TPorter2]

"I find myself using a separate system for home (personal) and for work. I'm wondering if any others do the same thing."

I do the same thing, westwind. My work system is Goldmine, and my home system is all on my Palm. I never sync the two, because for me the contexts don't cross over much. I don't bring work home, and I rarely do personal stuff at work.

[Cikub]

I guess what it boiled down to for me was that although Covey was quite helpful in clarifying purposes and planning to accomplish them, it didn't amount to nearly as much without GTD as with GTD. Covey provided a map, but David Allen provided a car, some gas and a couple of credit cards. :-)

Gordon

Ah, this is the best analogy so far. And I think that both Covey and Allen would agree with the assessment. I agree with those who say that they are not competing philosophies. The only real contrast is the concept of a daily prioritized list, and even here, Covey downplays the value of daily to-do lists.

I think Covey has a personal mission in life to encourage people to focus on timeless principles and what matters most to them, so they can feel peace about their lives.

I think Allen has a personal mission in life to encourage people to manage their committments so that they can feel relaxed enough to focus on what matters most to them.

Where's the conflict? We can, and should, focus on both our commitments and our missions.

Personally, I follow GTD to track and define my entire landscape. I often use weekly and daily planning to focus my attention and get the most bang for my time/buck.

C

[Nellas]

I too have explored various Time Management programs including GTD & Franklin/Covey.

By far, the most effective program for me has been Tony Robbin's RPM (Rapid Planning Method) presented in his "Time of Your Life" series. Now I do incorprate bits and pieces of GTD for my daily to-do actions, the majority of my higher level planning is based around the RPM model.

RPM is based on 3 questions:
1 - What do you want?
2 - Why do you want it?
3 - What are any and all possible ways I can make it happen?

The key I find is the Why. By clarifying what it is I want in my life and why I want it, I end up finding many ways to make it happen regardless of what obstacles may come up throughout the day/week.

[GTDmw]

I started with Covey in 1993 and found that the ideas he shared in his books and tapes moved my thinking forward. He gave me a structure to use that helped me frame my purpose in life. It helped me improve my focus on what was, and is, important in my life. The main concepts that I carry with me thanks to Covey are:

- Start with the end in mind. Starting at the end of my life and working backwards was very helpful. I did not define everything in a day. It takes time and is always work in progress.

- Once I visioned the end I defined the roles in my life. I have 7 roles with goals. My roles are - - Role 1: Individual, R2-Husband/Father, R3-Family/Friends, R4-Community, R5-Execute my job, R6-Serve my customers, R7-Develop as an employee. I have used these for over 10 years and they still serve me well even with GTD (see below for more details).

- Then there is the weekly view. I expanded this to the two week view. It worked better for me to review two weeks at a time.

- Last, response-ability. Stimulus prompts a response. You have the ability to choose base on your roles, goals, values etc.

These concepts helped me a lot over the years. Now enter in GTD. When I first finished the book I thought, "this is the missing link!" My runway was clogged with projects and next actions. I had too much in psychic RAM. Here is how I integrate Covey and GTD:

1. I use the following structure to define my project names:

@P[Rn]Project name

@P = Tells me it is a project.
[Rn] = Tells me what role this project is related to

Examples:
@P[R1]Purchase punch card for health club
@P[R2]Birthday party for son
@P[R3]Annual trip with college friends to Vegas
@P[R4]Sign up to coach youth basketball
@P[R5]Complete performance reviews for staff
@P[R6]Conduct Voice of Customer research with company X
@P[R7]Complete training on XYZ


My next actions would look something like this:
If it is tied to a project:
@Calls
[R2]Birthday party for son - Call clown at 555-5555

If it is a pure next action not associate with a project it would look like this:
@Errands
R2 Pick up flowers for my wife
R4 Pick up hot dogs for Home Association picnic

-The "R2" reminds me of my goals as a husband.
-The "R4" reminds me that I desire to be a positive member of my community

Based on my role and goals I find it pretty easy to make intuitive decisions on what to do next. For me, dropping the A,B,C priorities has saved much time and energy.

I hope this adds to the discussion.

[emuelle1]

Great advice! I hope you don't mind if I borrow from it.

I came across Franklin in 1996, and used it off and on for years. Even when I decided to stop buying planner refills, I found a way to adapt it to PDAs, starting with a Casio Casiopia and then a Palm Zire and finally two Pocket PCs. I've always looked for ways to do it simpler. I liked that Franklin Covery provides complete documentation for your life, and yet that's always been my downfall. I like the approach in GTD of throwing papers away and deleting emails when the action has passed.

I've always stuck the the advice to have only one calendar. It works good for me, especially since my wife and I have a one year old and another one due this week, so work is about the only time I have to do some things when I'm able to.

[andersons]

For years in cognitive science researchers debated whether human cognition was top-down or bottom-up. Now the debate is largely over because it has become obvious that the answer is both.

Yet another obvious truth about top-down processing is that it is much more powerful than bottom-up. For example, vision is generally thought of as bottom-up. Some light hits your retina where receptors convert it to neural signals transmitted across the optic nerve to occipital cortex and beyond. Eventually you will become aware of "seeing" the stimulus. But we can also give a subject in an experiment an instruction which alters the way her brain "sees" that same stimulus. So with one top-down instruction, millions of neurons, entire brain systems can work differently. That is the power of Covey.

With GTD, there is a danger that you can feel good about how organized you are and how many actions you have accomplished today, but you have still neglected the things that would ultimately make the biggest difference in your life.

It doesn't matter how much you are getting done if you're not getting the right things done.

Time management/productivity approaches come and go. At any time, one generates a lot of buzz. But what happens is that when something becomes fashionable, many people do the easiest things in the approach and neglect the hard ones. This happened with Covey and mission statements. Everyone wrote one. But few wrote them as Covey described they should be: both reflecting reality and aligned with true principles. That's hard to do. Consequently, although mission statements haven't disappeared -- DavidCo has one, as does everyone else -- people became disillusioned with their value.

GTD seems to be the fashionable productivity approach for now, but if people don't keep a balanced view of it, its popularity will fade when the next big approach points out that people now have tidy desks, lists, and inboxes, but haven't really accomplished much more of value.

GTD's treatment of top-down (50,000+ feet or whatever it is) is impoverished compared to Covey's. And Covey's approach to bottom-up runway-level is impoverished compared to GTD. They complement each other really well.

[mcogilvie]

GTD's treatment of top-down (50,000+ feet or whatever it is) is impoverished compared to Covey's. And Covey's approach to bottom-up runway-level is impoverished compared to GTD. They complement each other really well.

Andersons has given an insightful analysis of popular infatuation and disillusionment with "time management" programs. Apparently few people remember today that "Franklin Covey" was originally two separate companies. Covey was always about thinking about doing, while Franklin was more practical, with planners to support a well-defined approach to daily behavior. Both were strong on goals and values, but not very good at the intermediate, project level. In my opinion, this weakness continues today in the combined company.

The GTD scheme of 20K=Roles (or Focus Areas), 30-50K=Long-range goals is workable for me. DA doesn't walk you through it the way he does 0K-10K. but then again the Covey books are weak on implementation at higher levels too. My favorite approach is still "Your Best Year Yet" by Jenny Ditzler, which really walks you through a higher-level analysis of where you are, where you want to go, and what needs to change.

[bmd]

This posting board consistently elicits THE most thoughtful, empathetic, helpful, and beautifully stated comments I read anywhere, in any medium. Many thanks to all of you who contributed so generously to this thread! You have no idea how you're helping the fledglings!

[Busydave]

Yesterday, I gave away my copy of 7 Habits to the charity shop. It was “well thumbed” (as they say) and heavily underlined. But I found that whenever I picked it up to refresh myself on its principals the whole thing just went by in a swoosh of good intentions, with not one solid toe-hold.

So either:

(a) The whole Covey thing is just a load of idealistic hot air, or

(b) I am thoroughly versed in top-down thinking … but still frustrated in bottom up/where-the-rubber-meets-the-road thinking – (taking action and actually doing something): hence GTD, Robbins and Brian Tracy are my constantly referred to resources.

Dave

[arthur]

My favorite approach is still "Your Best Year Yet" by Jenny Ditzler, which really walks you through a higher-level analysis of where you are, where you want to go, and what needs to change.

I agree with that. Jenny Ditzler put together an outstanding book. I have read quite a few book on goals and I believe it’s currently on top. She makes it so easy. Many people are successfully using the method. Outstanding.

Best Year Yet (http://www.bestyearyet.com/)


...

[pageta]

I guess what it boiled down to for me was that although Covey was quite helpful in clarifying purposes and planning to accomplish them, it didn't amount to nearly as much without GTD as with GTD. Covey provided a map, but David Allen provided a car, some gas and a couple of credit cards. :-)

Gordon

I would say this sums it up beautifully. I've been a goal-setter/Covey model follower for many years. I set my goals, figure out what I want to do, but I only get about 5% of it done. Really bad, I know. Now with GTD, I would say my success rate is more like 95%.

I love GTD, but I must say that I still do use portions of Covey. If I still worked in corporate America, I don't think I would have much use for Covey. But as a self-employed SAHM, I need the guidance and direction that Covey gives. The roles and goals are the most helpful for me.

Do I have a mission statement? No, and I don't feel bad about not having one anymore. But when I do my weekly review, I like to think about my roles and goals and make sure I'm moving forward in all of the areas that I want to be. If I make sure I have next actions or projects for all of them, then I can just follow GTD during the week.

I definitely need the "map" that Covey gives in order to get the things done that I really want to get done. And I get nothing done without the "car" that GTD gives me for putting things into action.

[Danny Hardesty]

It is always fun to tinker with the details of both systems. Tomorrow, when I get to work, I will empty the contents of that day's tickler file and get to work on those items after checking my calendar (hardscape) for appointments. (ala GTD)

If you can manage it, it is sometimes helpful to take the "rocks" (high priority items) and actually schedule those for a particular date and time on your calendar to make sure they get done. (ala Covey-Franklin)

I generally take an eclectic approach and use both systems throughout the week. Which "system" works best for you will depend on your job reqirements and the manner in which work is delegated to or through you by superiors.

Danny Hardesty

www.dannyhardesty.com

[Brent]

There is no Silver Bullet.

There are, however, bullets.

[tjisolutions]

I have "read them all"...from Lakein's classic all the way through to current best-sellers. After reading all of the classic time management books my desk was still a mess, piles were everywhere, and it was disheartening to look at an ever-growing dog-eared "to-do" list which cluttered up an already junked up desk.

Then David's book Getting Things Done came along. Miracles do happen...the desk is now clean...file cabinets are orderly....the in-box is empty and collecting dust....the "to-do" list is a thing of the past, and my powerful engine "the tickler file" is hidden away in a drawer inside my executive desk and roaring to go.

To make a long story short, David's "system" is simply the best.

Danny Hardesty

www.dannyhardesty.com

Maybe I missed it somewhere but isn't the intent of getting things done, getting things actually done?- not "clean", "empty", "tickled" and "roaring to go"

[mcogilvie]

Maybe I missed it somewhere but isn't the intent of getting things done, getting things actually done?- not "clean", "empty", "tickled" and "roaring to go"

Sure. For most of us GTD'ers, a clean desk and an empty in-box are signs that things are getting done, freeing us to focus on the next action at hand. A tickler file is just a tool for clarifying what actions we want to happen when. I am very sure that I work better when I get my in-box to empty regularly, just as I now know how to get it to empty, thanks to David Allen.

P.S. Even an expatriate Texan like me knows that "roaring to go" is a good thing!